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Sorry guys.  I get grumpy sometimes.  I get over-passionate sometimes.  I don't want users to leave.  I'll gladly take the reminder spankings if it means we can get some answers.  And we did.  The most important one... there are commercial forces steering BJS.  THAT's the one I wanted to hear, or not hear.  The whole "ships" thing smelled like that, and tasted like that, and it was that.


I suspect the same thing is happening for BabylonDoc.  Should I care?  Would it matter?  sigh.  How should I feel?  Tact first, truth of feelings never? 

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Please DK, do not get discouraged. You are doing a work so great about this engine. You are a developer with a working exemplary and rigorous treatment. An engine of this quality is a chance to use it for free.

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We all are human beings.

Misundestanding, discouragement, anger, disappointement, fear and opinion differences are all human legitimate feelings and should happen sometimes.


Maybe is it even very safe they happen sometimes, nope ?

Sometimes people have to express what they really think or feel because it is really important to them, even if they disagree. 

Since they can make it up then with themselves, maybe is it a good thing for solving sensitive problems ?


I don't know, I'm no shrink  :)

For having managed teams (sports and work) for years, I just can say this kind of stuff (expressing problems with feelings) is inevitable in a human group and usually beneficial to the group on the long term  :)

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Thanks Jerome.  I agree.


Ya'll seem to be real concerned about DK's motivation getting damaged,  but I'm going to show you how "we" damaged Jerome's motivation, and more than once.


Post #2 in this thread.  It's Jerome, hearing about BJS 2, hoping to see his code on the list of What's New... and starting to get rushed.


Post #5 - DK telling Jerome of "the deadline" and not telling Jerome a thing as to IF Jerome can still make the cutoff date, or ANY OTHER indicator of ANYTHING.  Let's all punch Jerome.  Yay.  Ain't this fun?


Post #6 - Jerome starts to panic... trying to learn too many things, too fast, about getting code included in BJS.  Let's all watch Jerome bleed.  YAY!!!


Post #7 - "Actually everything is ready :) I just have to virtually push a button :)"  Alright.  Guess what, Jerome?  "Everything is ready".  So your code won't be making it into 2.0... end of discussion on THAT subject, and you don't get to know the reason why not.  Let's all punch Jerome again.  YAY!  This might be one of most cruel posts I've ever seen.


At this point, I have a PM with Jerome (essentially apologizing to Jerome, and telling him that I'm going to try to get some answers).  I then PM DK, asking if there's ANYTHING that can be done to get ANYTHING of Jerome's... into 2.0.  The reply doesn't sound at all encouraging.  "No rush" was amongst the simple reply.


ooookay.  Apparently nobody sees Jerome rushing.


Post #9 - Wingy tries to light-heartedly break it to Jerome that he won't be making it into 2.0 no matter how hard he tries.


Post #11 - Jerome accepts his rejection of being in 2.0, and stalwartly gets back to work trying to learn the currently-undocumented things he needs to learn... to avoid being frozen out of 2.01.


Then later, I have to tell Jerome that my comment about 2.01 was just a joke I made.  Let's punch Jerome in the head yet again!!!  I gave him false hope of a magical v 2.01!  Way to  go, Wingy!


I tell ya... if ya'll were HALF as concerned about Jerome's motivation... as you seem to be about DK's motivation... this merry crap-on-Jerome festival wouldn't have been an issue AT ALL!


Yes, Jerome threw us a forum curveball.  He asked... "Is it best to start different threads for different subjects, or best to put it all in one thread".  Somebody answered "best in separate".  We didn't know Jerome could multi-task 10 subjects at once, and he then sprayed the forum with his thoughts.  We didn't have enough knowledgeable people on forum custodian duty.... to handle the question load.  Plus, it was not a good time for DK, and the forum was generally low on users during this time, particularly those who could tune-into Jerome's frequency.


Wingy panics.  I fumble around trying to answer Jerome's questions, and I start ending my posts with "and the experts say...", begging for help so we wouldn't lose a new trailblazer.  I get some replies, mostly "I'm really busy".  Alright, let's punch Jerome while he's already laying on the ground!  Yay!


But if THIS would make ya'll feel better about yourselves... then it was ME who dropped the ball.  I was the one who was not educated enough in the things that Jerome was asking... to properly custodian Jerome's high-speed forum posts.  I am a member of this community, and I couldn't handle the situation.


Enough said?  I don't take back a single word.  But I was the part of the community that failed... not anyone or anything else.


Now, about this commercialization.  Cover your butts, people.  This thing could turn into a giant Microsoft popsicle-o-luring in the blink of an eye.  You say it's all secret stuff, DK?  Yep.  It's secret alright.  Don't give-in to the dark side, please... I beg of you!!!  But my begging is of no consequence, now is it?  Not against "the forces".  Cover your butts, people.  I trust the authors and admin, but I do not trust the waters they wade-in.

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What can I say ..?

Because I am concerned , I feel very sorry and overwhelmed by what my post triggered. Really :(


I probably don't use right emoticons or english words. So I generate misunderstanding :(

"To name things wrongly is to add to the misfortune of the world" - Albert Camus


Yes, Wingy, I felt rushed and I do appreciate you care about me, although I don't think I deserve so much attention (I even haven't done a decent PR so far).

But I won't give up just because my PR will be integrated in the next release only. My ego will survive this kind of decision ;) .

I probably don't express very well and probably too fast also. This is my fault. I'll try to write then just factual posts with some low-frequency rythm.


Yes DK, I can understand there are rules to lead a community project and I really don't ask for any dispensation.


Please, readers, consider there is ever a big smiley emoticon in the background of all my posts, even if I don't express well my thought :mellow: .



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I'm sorry Wingy but I do not get your point. I cannot commit to respond to everyone immediately.


Babylon.js stable versions work this way since the very beginning and once again I do not get where is the problem for Jerome. He will be able to commit as soon as he will be ready and he will be part of the 2.1.


Where is the problem? We have consumers apps using babylon.js so what? where is the problem? Why are you talking about "giant Microsoft popsicle-o-luring: ? This is a APACHE 2 open source project.

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Do you REALLY think I did not add more info on purpose?


Post #5 - DK telling Jerome of "the deadline" and not telling Jerome a thing as to IF Jerome can still make the cutoff date, or ANY OTHER indicator of ANYTHING.  Let's all punch Jerome.  Yay.  Ain't this fun?


I should have been overbooked at that time. Nothing more.

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Oh we're going to return to hiding things from the community?  Yeah, there's a good idea.  Let's do some more secrets.


As far as I'm concerned, you can clean/wipe the thread.  I need to evaluate my surroundings and make sure there's not something else bothering me (like a thorn in my butt or something) :)


I have nothing else to say at this time.  The issue has been brought to light, and I hope it never happens again.  I'm going to begin figuring out which code editors and IDE's ... can pipe-to Microsoft's typescript, and try to start filling this recently-experienced gap in documentation.  Also, maybe Github for Dummies.  Also maybe BabylonDoc for Dummies, as I am not doing so well at learning it, either.


No misunderstanding.  Just Wingy getting PO'd at a series of events that REALLY REALLY happened.

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No, I'm not angry at anyONE.  I'm "grumpy" at a series of events that happened on the forum.  A series of events that caused unneeded BS upon Jerome.  I blame the community... which I am a member-of... so I mostly blame ME.


Let's just leave the corporate influencing of BJS on the side-burner.  Let's do one issue at a time.


Again, it was a series of events on the forum... that irked me.  I saw an enthusiastic child-like-happy Jerome... not getting questions answered... hoping with high-excitement to be included in the framework, but no, not yet.  It happens.


And what caused this freeze-up of 2.0?  Corporations.  Oh boy.  Ever seen a ship date punch a Rodez kid in the head?  Well ya just did now.


Yeah, download Microsoft products!  YAY! 


DK, you are just burying yourself in the mud, here.  Do you REALLY want to peddle a Microsoft product at this time and place?


Somebody, ANYBODY... say "typescript for linux".  Say it with me now, just to feel clean again.  :)

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I decided to only keep good things for now :)


So about vs2013, this is free and works well. This is what I'm using. Nothing more. I'm sharing my experience. I know that JCP uses different stuff on Mac but I do not know what.


On linux I dunno but I'm pretty sure you will find a way. I think that Sublime text + gulp should make it


As a side note: I answered questions from Jerome. So once again I do not get what you mention here. I double checked with him, asking if he thinks he was not helped enough by me.


Perhaps this is my fault as davrous mentioned. I try always to get questions answered as fast as possible. This has created a bad habit. And when I'm less available people are disappointed

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Don't worry, Wingy, I feel right about that.

I don't want you people to fight because of me, please :(

As I said, it's not important.


Please all keep in mind we just animate colored pixel here :D

Nothing of vital importance.


We are all consentant adults.

We can all expose our opinion and feel free to quit if we don't like the way things are going, nope ?

So I won't quit, neither give up. :)

All this stuff is not about my person (I hope) which has no importance. Not much than other member here. :mellow:

Please don't worry about me.


Maybe are there surely deeper topics to be discussed between you, administrators or old implicated members ? about the way to lead the project, the direction to be followed, etc ? :huh:

I guess the real point is here.

I'm too novice to have a forged opinion about this.

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per your request, I went through request site to find all missing new features.  Except for ones I was involved with, I'll leave the exact wording up to you. Some are exporter related, which do not always require 2.0.

Not going to wade into this other stuff,  I have my own problems.  Another Monday, and another foot+ of snow :(

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