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realistic hair wouhou it`s my first contract using babylon.js !


benoit-1842
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yeah I am very happy to work with babylon.js for this contract !!!!!  But the challenge is huge !!!!  I must create realistic hair with webgl....  Does somebody could point me a direction where I could start !!!  I am using the weighted blended order-independant transparency algorithm but my challenge is to port that in webgl land.......

 

Any help about creating realistic hair in babylon.js will much appreciated.....

 

Thanx,

 

Benoit

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  • 1 month later...

One big delta I see between this beautiful spring demo posted by davrous and, for instance, our nice Train demo is that the spring demo is super nice with very few assets and textures, leading to a very short loading time, while the train demo is also very nice, but sooo long to load.

The demo page on the BJS website is good to demonstrate BJS functionnalities but there as many beautifull as "awfull" demos (aesthetically I mean). Among our demos, I think we should more bring forward those which are purely contemplative / graphically a delight to watch. And it would be good to enhance the oldest one.

For instance, Techemon vertexdata demo is particularly a nice one, but it could be reworked to add more interesting things to look at (a sun, with some flares, a bird somewhere...). The Hillvaley could be enhanced with new materials, reflexions on windows, water in the pond.

I'm just poping ideas, I know all of that requires time, volonteers and artistic competences...

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On the website, I try to keep aesthetic demo on the first part and feature demos (awful ones) in the second part.

 

I'm COMPLETELY open to update these demos (everything is available here: https://github.com/BabylonJS/Samples)

 

Please send PR if you are motivated. My problem is that I'm not a designer at all :(

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I'm COMPLETELY open to update these demos (everything is available here: https://github.com/BabylonJS/Samples)

 

Please send PR if you are motivated. My problem is that I'm not a designer at all :(

 

I'm also completely open to update these demos. My problem is that I don't have time at all (already so busy I barely can see my little family or simply sleep enough... :(, hope this will change but, sadly, certainly not before the next two years I estimate... :mellow:). But I can bring ideas, and give aesthetical advices to the ones who have time to put hands on.

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I don't think our demos have aesthetic/awfulness problems.

 

The features demos don't need to be that aesthetic, they must focus on the feature and have not too many lines of code so as the user can understand at a glance how it is done.

 

The aesthetic demos (in the site first part) must impress the people, be the most beautiful and stunning as possible. Just what Mitch (and Davrous for the sounds) did : beautiful scenes with fantastic textures, effects, etc.

They are awsome although quite static : the user can move in the scene, can explore, look at things, hear... but nothing more happens.

 

What we lack, imho, is another kind of demo which doesn't necesseraly requires much design but more computed / animated / generated beautiful things.

Something more complex and integrated than our current feature demos but not as designed as our aesthetic ones, focusing more in dynamic experience.

There are plenty of these demos with 3JS and they are really nice.

Although, they often under the hood rely intensively more on dedicated shaders than on the framework built-in functions. 

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Jerome, I looked at a lot of those  3JS demos and as davrous has pointed out there are some aesthetically pleasing pieces but ...  So just a couple of comments for now.

 

1. What makes the Lego stuff so special - I used LDraw years ago to create Lego scenes and characters? And some scenes made me feel quite sick with some of the weird camera movement that seems to be used to make some scenes look dynamic.

 

2. Some of your PG scenes for ribbons and parametric meshes seemed to me to be as good or better than some of those 3JS demos. Trouble is they are buried in the playground. Or bouncing balls - again some of Raananw's examples are buried in the PG

 

3. There is a blog by DK entitled :

 

Babylon.js: a complete Javascript framework for building 3D games with HTML5 and WebGL

 

Where are the 3D games from 3JS or BJS? Temechon has 3 or 4, including a rather nice puzzle which has tiles that flip, and iiceman has a nice maze - but not much more.

 

We know that BJS has some great tools for users to interact with scenes - the action manager - but good interactive demos? 3D games are about interaction.

 

The only interaction I saw in the 3JS demos was clicking on on some HTML to change a troll's animation.

 

Viewers want to interact with the screen - not to just sit there passively saying oooh and ahh - if they did, it might as well be a movie.

 

Enough for now.

 

cheers, gryff :)

 

Edit - There are two demo pieces on the BJS site that do have some interaction the old mansion when you get near the graves, and the most recently added button demo. But neither in my opinion brings out the full BJS  action manager sophistication. :)

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My thoughts are very similar to jerome and gryff - that we have the tools to tackle the aesthetics, although more need to be built which are accessible to a broad user base with varying backgrounds.  What I hear mostly from the groups I work with in entertainment production as well as industrial design such as Lockheed Martin, is that they chose 3JS because of the immense library of functions and extensions which came from being the first accessible framework with some guts behind it.

 

However, after working a little while in 3JS, I chose BabylonJS as my company's primary development framework for browser apps because of it's legacy as a game engine which has been and is highly adaptible.  I found 3JS quite a bit restrictive when it came to working with characters, skeletons, and hierarchial animation - which is primarily my background, and where my company has been working for a long time now.

 

What I'm personally most impressed by in the "spring" demo is the application of proceedural animation for most of the environment.  Simple user tools is where I believe BJS will grow it's user base the quickest, as well as providing more tools for animating and working with characters and animation.  As I mentioned on a seperate post, Autodesk just announced they're pouring tens of millions of dollars into HTML5 and WebGL applications - by which we will see a whole lot of new users coming to both 3JS and BJS in the next year.  I'm certain that our forum will increase several times it's current user base in the next year bringing allot of new ideas and manpower to this great framework which DK has put his heart and soul, as well as his sweat into building over many years now.

 

As like most everyone else, I simply don't have the time to build demos as I'd truly like to do.  However, my contribution perhaps might be that the real-time multiuser drawing and design app - which I'm painfully trying to finish amongst other projects - is going to Weta in NZ for broad beta testing beginning in January, and we'll be capitalizing on this as much as we can highlighting that BabylonJS and this community - which has provided me with amazing support - is the only way I could have accomplished building this on my own.  I have other developers, but they are working on the server and other technologies, and I'm completely self taught in software development, which means I've been winging it. This new app along with the server allows any # of users to draw onto and manipulate 3D meshes as well as draw directly on video and design illustrations all in real time and at the same time - with fully synced actions.  Weta has been really looking forward to using this, and they are in full support of BJS - which will only grow in the coming months.

 

So, perhaps we might consider organizing some demos around a group of users here, as opposed to all flying solo in building and posting demos.  We might consider focusing on our individual strengths and applying these to demo projects as a group.  It's just a thought, but I'm certainly willing to contribute from my personal experience in character animation, motion capture, audio engineering, music composition, and a few other aspects of both entertainment and industrial media.  I know everyone wants to build games, so we can do this also; providing we don't get carried away, and build some mind blowing content to showcase this amazing framework which is our future - at least for most of us.

 

This is an exciting time for me, as well as I'm certain it is for most everyone on this forum.  Be prepared for a huge boom and acceptance of native HTML5 and WebGL apps and games in the coming year, as well as all of the battles I've been fighting for groups I work with to adopt these standards and specifically BJS, are about to come to fruition.  I know I've been on and off topic here a bit, but I wanted to simply provide my perspective on the industry, as well as proposing joining in on some organized demos which work on both an aesthetic and technical level.  I've seen all the components on this forum as well as amazing talent; it's just a matter of pulling these all together to create some media which to blow people away.

 

And to benoit- 1842 congratulations on an actual contract earning income (hopefully) from using the Babylon.js framework.  I guarantee there's a whole lot more of work to come using this fantastic set of tools and the engine driving it.  I know those of us who have not contributed to the writing of the actual framework are eternally grateful to those few who are still building and improving daily.

Again, congrats!  :D

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Creating dedicated new demos and games would be excellent. But for now many playgrounds are created everyday to test functionnalities. Among all of those, some are interesting enough to demonstrate the true power of BJS (they are about everything, features, shaders, interaction, powerfull functions, rendering, optimisations, etc), but they are lost in thousands of forums posts. Maybe we should have a dedicated post to reference the bests (each time a super PG is created, one could post the link and a quick description) with a poll to decide if that particular PG should or not appear on the demo page. And if this PG is updated afterward (bringing really more interest than previous version), we should have a way to update the demo page.

The idea is to have a system where the community can choose what they think would be nice to show to the world.

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yeah I am very happy to work with babylon.js for this contract !!!!!  But the challenge is huge !!!!  I must create realistic hair with webgl....  Does somebody could point me a direction where I could start !!!  I am using the weighted blended order-independant transparency algorithm but my challenge is to port that in webgl land.......

 

Any help about creating realistic hair in babylon.js will much appreciated.....

 

Thanx,

 

Benoit

 

I think you need create some cool Shaders (if you need realistic hairs).

Fur and hair simulations is real hard task for any 3D engine.

Get this task as first job is real challenge!

In modern games (as Witcher III) hair simulation has hardware support (nvidia) and have individual settings that major depended on game perfomance.

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Maybe we should have a dedicated post to reference the bests (each time a super PG is created, one could post the link and a quick description) with a poll to decide if that particular PG should or not appear on the demo page. And if this PG is updated afterward (bringing really more interest than previous version), we should have a way to update the demo page.

The idea is to have a system where the community can choose what they think would be nice to show to the world.

 

We are working on this :) But you can already create a new page in the documentation to list the best one !

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